Part V of the BTC Aug. 24 meeting transcription, with editorial and glib comments added for free

By John Estridge

EDITOR’S NOTE AND EDITORIAL COMMENT: This is the fifth of a multi-part transcription of the August 24 Brookville Town Council meeting’s pertinent parts relating to the Golf Course Purchase, Zimmer Building Purchase and Frisbee Golf Course. I wanted to break this down into parts because it will be a very long piece, if I can even finish it. It takes a long, long time to go over and over a recording to do a transcription, especially with how fast and slurred Curtis Ward, BTC president, is when he begins talking about something that apparently excites him.

Part IV ended with the abrupt end to public comment after the only person who spoke for the town purchasing the golf course had left the podium and the crowd was left in a seemingly chaotic fashion. All of that had been enabled by Curtis.

This Part V is almost entirely Curtis selling the community on the $1 million purchase of a failing Pig in a Poke Golf Course.

Curtis Ward: “All right, so before we before this ordinance on discussion with the golf course purchase, I will file this with Gina, and Gina will file it with the State Board of Accounts. My conflict of interest disclosure, which must be filed within 15 days of accepting a contract. This states that I have property within the proposed annexation area and properties adjoining the Brook Hill Golf Club.”

There is loud talking all around the room as Curtis is speaking.

Dusty Robinson: (Talked in various first parts of the meeting) “Curtis, Curtis, Curtis… can you ask Mr. Bauman…” (Mr. (Brian) Bauman was the last person to speak in Part IV. He was the only person to speak who was in favor of purchasing the golf course. Brian also sold Curtis nine lots adjacent to the golf course on July 7 for a purported large sum. That acreage is about 12 acres, overall. Something to keep in mind near the end of Part V.

Curtis Ward: “Dusty, Dusty…”

Another male from audience: “Mr. Bauman’s talking back here.”

Dusty Robinson: “I can’t hear anything you’re saying Curtis because Mr. Bauman is talking back here.”

Ken Murphy: (Talked in various first parts of this meeting) “You were going to tell us about the financial aspects about the golf course.”

Curtis Ward: “We’re actually having board discussion before I can have board discussion about this financial disclosure. We will discuss that next. So, the board may have an opportunity to read this before Gina files it with the State Board of Accounts. At the last meeting, we told the public we were in beginning negotiations with the LLC to turn, to go over the purchase offer. There have been questions regarding the finances, so what I’ve done is I’ve created an overview, because we have agreed to a nondisclosure agreement between the LLC and the town. So, we are not going to go over any of the financial details other than what they have agreed to allow to publicly be put out there.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT: Let’s take a break for a couple of seconds so everyone can read that last sentence again. Curtis, sometimes – no, no, all the time, he does not act like he ever represents the taxpayers within the present town limits. He seems to believe he represents the LLC members or his fellow real estate agents, his own billfold or any other wealthy person’s billfold. Curtis said: “So, we are not going to go over any of the financial details other than what they have agreed to allow to publicly be put out there.” Curtis is really looking out for our interests there. I bet there was some tough negotiating going on to come to that nondisclosure agreement. I wonder what we, as taxpayers, got in return for the town agreeing to a nondisclosure agreement, which I believe is unenforceable? Probably nothing. Can you imagine being the other person in negotiations with Curtis? How could the other person not laugh out loud all the time? That takes some real self control to not laugh out loud at Curtis’ tough negotiation strategies. Now, back to Curtis’ monologue.

Curtis Ward: “This is consistent with what we did as with Sparky Renaker back with his financial details previously with Darrel Flaspohler (former BTC member, who was narrowly defeated by Chuck Campbell at the last election. Chuck votes with Curtis on everything so it was like re-electing Darrel) and myself.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT: I’m sorry to interrupt so often, but this really amazes me. What were we buying when Curtis and Darrel were in negotiations with Sparky? According to Curtis, earlier in this series, the LLC was not around when Sparky first wanted to sell. However, later in the series when talking to, I think Bernie Rosenberger, Curtis said the LLC was around at that time. If the latter statement is true, and remember Curtis’ lips were moving when he made both statements and that, in and of itself, is problematic, Curtis and Darrel, two town council members at that moment and supposedly representing US, THE TAXPAYERS, were apparently negotiating a purchase agreement between two private entities. I am not an attorney but the legal ramifications of that is … well, to steal a saying from the 70s, mind blowing. Curtis said at the meeting, the town committed to buying the golf course three years ago, but I have never seen a written purchase agreement saying that. Oh well, I believe we should all trust Curtis. Also, Curtis loves those nondisclosure agreements, which seem really unAmerican for a public entity to hide financial statements of businesses taxpayers are buying. He and Darrel apparently negotiated one with Sparky. Now, back to the monologue.

Curtis Ward: “So, the agreement we have committed to previously was the $1 million purchase price. That price is still unchanged from three years ago. Uh, so, we’ve heard from multiple people tonight saying that the town was able to do a pool. There was a lot of excitement around the pool so I want to do a slight comparison from the Brookville Golf Course to the Heap/Hofer Town Aquatic Center. The price for the golf course acquisition is $1 million. The price for the Heap/Hofer Town Aquatic Center was $3.8 million.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT: As was pointed out on Social Media after this meeting was live, this meant the pool’s construction cost was $400,000 more than what we were told. Does anyone remember this being a public statement until Curtis told us this figure on Aug. 24? Maybe there was a nondisclosure agreement with the contractor on the pool. And, just maybe Curtis violated that agreement by telling us the truth, if it is the truth. As I said with Curtis’ monologue those kinds of things, like the truth, are problematic.

Curtis Ward: “Yet the town rallied around that for kids to be able to swim in the summer, myself included. $2 million of that was financed by the town. Uh, through the PPC process we discussed previously. Now just for comparison, for $1 million, we are buying 173 acres of greenspace that is currently operated as a golf course. For $3.8 million, we built a pool that was located on .6 acre. So, 173 acres for $1 million and $3.8 million for .6 acre. Uh, memberships for the golf course, uh this year, in 2021, they had increased memberships from 22 members when they purchased it initially to 108 members.”

Several members of the crowd at the same time: “Woo”

Curtis Ward: “Please, we were respectful when you guys talked so if you are respectful now, we can hurry up and get this done and you can go back to doing what you want. But, please be respectful of our time. There’s a high number of memberships that they have with over 271 golfers within those family membership packages. We have 188 memberships at the town aquatic center. Membership revenue for the golf course for those 108 is $90,000. Membership revenue for the aquatic center was $24,000 so it was with less members, they created more revenue.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT Just to let everyone know, it was hard at the meeting to not interrupt the lack of logic here, and it is much harder now, but I will try to wait until Curtis is done. I would hate to be disrespectful to someone who has represented my interests and keeps my tax money so well. But please, please, please go to the video so one can hear how proud of himself Curtis is with this part of the monologue. If there are any therapists out there who want to weigh in at this point, please feel free.

Curtis Ward: “Total revenue in 2021, and this … I will repeat this again, was $400,000 at the golf course for total revenue. Total revenue to date for the Heap/Hofer Town Aquatic Center is $75. So for our $3.8 million, we have raised $75 million.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT: Curtis was excited. Again, go to the video to see how pleased with himself he is for this little economic study he is enlightening us with. Although Curtis said $75 million, I believe he meant $75,000 and Brooke Leffingwell knew the correct amount and immediately enlightened him. Again, I know everyone is raising their hands at this point for permission to point out the obvious to Curtis about all this, but again, be respectful because Curtis and his four cronies have been so respectful to you and me.

Curtis Ward: “I will preface that …”

Brooke Leffingwell: “$75,000.”

Curtis Ward: “$75,000, $75,000, sorry, that’s right. I will preface that no one ever expected, back when we looked at the pool rates, our goal was not to make money off the pool rates. Um, so, um, not every business or anything that we support is all about the d… dollars. Um, but $75,000 is what Heap/Hofer has brought in this year. Now, I want to talk a little bit about the price of Heap/Hofer, so, everyone supports the pool.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT: Fast-talking Curtis goes into overdrive here. I think what he was saying was people donated to have the pool built and he appreciates that BUT…

Curtis Ward: “$175,000. This year to date, we have lost $5,000 on that pool.

Ken Murphy: “Could you repeat the money from golf course that year-to-date that it made this year?”

Curtis Ward: “$400,000, $400,000 for the golf course and $75 for the pool. So, re…uh, the net re, the net, um about the pool, the pool is negative $5,000 and that’s before our loan payment of $140,000. So, this year to date, and we’re not done yet, we’ve lost $145,000 on the pool. Yet, the community rallies around that and thinks it is a great success. And I still think … not everything ventured by the town … is about making money.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT: My ellipses are words he said so fast I have no idea what they were. And before going on, I just cannot wait any longer so let me mention the elephant in the room, the elephant in my computer, the elephant in cyberspace, the elephant that is everywhere: We are privy to the costs associated with the pool. We are not privy with the expenses associated with the golf course because BTC President Curtis Ward signed a non-disclosure agreement with a private business we taxpayers are being forced to purchase. Why would the LLC demand a non-disclosure agreement? Oh my. Maybe even Curtis could get the right answer to that. It should be one of his rhetorical questions, he then supplies answers to. Now, $400,000 sounds impressive except when the costs are north of $500,000 or even more plus the cost of very much needed improvements, then it is not that impressive. If the LLC members were making a goodly amount of money off their investments, the town’s taxpayers would not have to purchase the golf course from the LLC. Also, remember, Curtis was moving his lips when he said all of this.

Curtis Ward: “It’s about providing a quality place for our constituents, you. However, I’m sure not everyone in the audience has used the pool. I used the pool with my kids, other board members and other people have (used the pool), but many other people have not. That’s how communities work. Not every aspect of what we do not every aspect of that park – I don’t play softball, yet it’s a great softball field and there’s a lot of people who do get enjoyment out of that. Not everything we do is about pleasing everybody. That’s not what council is here for. What we are trying to do is quality of place for our town residents. That is the first and foremost reason we want to purchase that golf course and that is to enhance the quality of life. The golf course has brought in over $100,000 in fundraising for local community organizations and charities. This includes scholarships for kids to go to school. Over $100,000 they brought in has been given directly back to charity. That’s one of the reasons I value the golf course. If that goes away, those dollars go to Liberty. It is going out of our county. That’s dollars we lose here that we’re not getting back. That’s less likely to happen, um, scheduling conflicts for these big events. The fire department nearly $10,000 raised on the golf course in dollars that helped offset the costs for the town. Dollars that go to public safety. And when we speak about public safety, we’re not saying the golf course is the end all be all salvation for the town. That’s not it. It’s just something that we feel strongly and has been felt strongly by three separate boards that we believe in this mission. We want to provide this for our community. You may not like it. You may not use it. Some people don’t like the pool. Some people did like the pool. Some people did not support it. However, that is what the town is about: about providing many different quality places and solving community problems as possible. So over $100,000 for organizations and they had over 60 kids this year do golf camps who would not be able to do golf camps in Franklin County in our community. What really this comes down to is we’re buying 173 acres of greenspace that we do intend to keep as a golf course because we feel that it is viable. The LLC has proven that in the last three years taking this from 22 members to 108 members, increasing revenue from a negative cash flow in the years that Sparky owned it to a positive cash flow this year, taking in over $400,000 in new revenue.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT: I’m sorry. There is just so much here to talk about. First, Curtis called us his constituents. I really expected everyone to break out into kum bah ya at the meeting. But it did not happen. And I am still disappointed over that. Now, let’s just skip that organizations could have raised money at places like Harbor Links and other area golf courses also without losing any of that money they brought in. You know if we’re not having to subsidize Pig in a Poke Golf Course to the tune of a quarter of a million per year, I don’t mind that the charity golf outings go to Liberty or Harbor Links or elsewhere. I think we will be money ahead. Also, it is nice that more than 60 kids went to a summer camp there. One of those was a granddaughter, but I do not want my neighbors subsidizing a failing golf course to this great extent so one of my granddaughters can go to a summer golf camp locally. Her parents can hire someone to give her lessons, give her lessons themselves or have another family member give her lessons, but my neighbors do not have to pay for her to have a summer camp. You know when people are desperate to prove a point like this, they always play the children card: Do it for the kids. It’s all about the children. Also, once again the elephant: If the “positive cash flow” was so good, there would not be a non-disclosure agreement Curtis doggedly negotiated for “you,” his constituents. Another point, and I am sure everyone saw all the flaws in this supposed logic, we who are against it should knuckle under and do it for the few who are for it. NO. NO. NO. NO. Comparing the pool and the golf course is nonsensical. Without the first payment, the pool would have lost $5,000. I am OK with that. Now, if the golf course loses $250,000 per year. No. I am not OK with that. And we will never know how much we are going to lose on the Pig in a Poke Golf Course because it is a Pig in a Poke.

Now, back to Curtis.

Curtis Ward: “Doing this the town can be successful. They (I think LLC members) could have kept the golf course. Some of them (LLC members?) wanted to keep the golf course. But they honored their commitment which was to bridge this from the time the town was able to buy this and the time the seller want to sell it.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT: Let’s forget this is an emergency that we have to buy the Pig in a Poke Golf Course RIGHT NOW purportedly because investors are not getting a return for their money (Ward statement at the August 10 meeting, which was printed in one of the other meeting parts). Now the LLC members want to keep it. Maybe, Curtis talked them out of keeping the golf course when he was negotiating the non disclosure agreement that might have told us some facts about expenses and the amount of money it will take to do many of the things necessary on that golf course RIGHT NOW.

Curtis Ward:  “If they had not done that the golf course would have been subdivided and not been a golf course today. We would not be sitting here.”

EDITORIAL COMMENT: I almost gave an AMEN at that point, but I was trying to be respectful.

Curtis Ward: “The big takeaway here is when people ask why buy the golf course for $1 million, that’s $5,708 per acre for 173 acres. Now I don’t know how many people, you can talk about me being a realtor, I do follow that. Brian (Bauman) follows that, many of you guys follow that but that is very low per acreage price. Large amounts of acreage up there are going for well above that.”

Wayne Monroe, who attends every BTC meeting: “Why did you go out of county to appraise property similar to that up there?”

Curtis Ward: “First thing we did not go out of the county to appraise anything. We hired two separate  appraisers (three years ago) who performed that subject to appraisal standards.”

Wayne Monroe: “That was compared with land clear up between Columbus, Indiana and Indianapolis.”

Curtis Ward: “You would have to ask the appraisers what their thoughts were.”

Wayne Monroe: “You was the one that was guiding them. Don’t sit there and lie to people.”

Curtis Ward: “We were guiding them?”

Wayne Monroe: “You’re damn right you was.”

Curtis Ward: “Uh, $5,708 per acre. That’s the snapshot. Cathy (Pelsor, town council member) do you have anything to add on the financials?”

Cathy Pelsor: “Curtis and I sat down with a member of the LLC today, and I was actually pleasantly surprised that they have done as well as they have. The reason we – I was part of the board that originally talked to the (county) commissioners and the golf course and members at that time. And we were wanting to save the golf course. That was, we wanted to save this for our community and that’s why we did it. So, the golf course is not failing. It’s a very viable business in our community, and I look for it to continue to do that. That’s why I’m voting.”

Curtis Ward: “Any other questions or discussions … from the board?”

That ends the council’s part of Part V. Curtis then read the purchase agreement, which will be Part VI.

EDITORIAL COMMENT: If as Cathy said the golf course is doing well and it is not failing. If it is very viable, then the private sector should gobble it up and continue to run the golf course so a private business can make interest on their investments. But, Curtis told us at the Aug. 10 meeting, the reason council had to purchase the golf course RIGHT NOW is the investors were not making any money on their investments. So, this has to be one way or the other: Either it is in such bad shape the investors want out RIGHT NOW so they can see some return on their investments, or the business is so good, it should be a viable option for a private entity to run it and make good money.

Either way, leave me out of it. Leave my neighbors out of it. Curtis, leave your constituents, “you,” as you called us, out of this. We neither want nor do we need a golf course.

Thank you.